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GoldMoney IRA Issues

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GoldMoney IRA

GoldMoney IRA holdings are administrated through Entrust Administration Inc. as the custodian. The costs do seem rather high and. Having a custodian between you and your purchasing power may negate part of the purpose of having a GoldMoney holding in the first place. But some people are comfortable with a GoldMoney IRA. So, this option is available. Here is a copy of the email one of my readers received when they enquired about the IRA option.

The following files were attached:

GoldMoney IRA Fee Schedule

Entrust Administration Form

Entrust Rollover Certification Form

Form 5305-A

All files in zipped.

The email received about a GoldMoney IRA:

“Thank you for your recent inquiry. We are excited you are contemplating using your retirement funds in your next investment.   We understand that diversifying your portfolio on non-traditional investments is important to our clients.   Purchasing within your tax sheltered retirement plans can certainly be key in that process.  We hope you decide to use our firm.

Entrust Administration Inc. is a third party administrator that specializes in the record keeping and tax reporting on Individual Retirement Accounts.  We can not sell or endorse any investment product, which means you, the accountholder are truly self-directing the retirement account.   As a potential client, who is interested in self-directing the account, we recommend conducting your due diligence through your private resources such as your legal, tax, and/or financial advisors to help guide you in your decision making process. You are welcome to visit our website www.TheEntrustGroup.com to review IRS regulation 4975 for information on prohibited transactions, disqualified family relationship, and self-dealing.

Please find the attached documents to establish an Entrust Administration, Inc. self-directed IRA account.  For your convenience the Gold Money fee disclosure is attached separately to this email.  You will need to complete and sign both fee disclosures and return them to our office to process your request.  Please note that the Entrust Administration, Inc. fees are separate and independent of the Gold Money fee disclosure.  The original signed documents are required to be mailed to Entrust Administration, Inc.

Please return the following by mail:

IRA account application

Entrust Administration, Inc.

Fee Disclosure

Transfer form with copy of current custodial IRA statement

Photo ID – The ID must still have a valid date (not expired) and Gold Money requires that the photo image, the printed information and the state/federal seal information must all be visible and clear.  Acceptable US state/federal photo IDs are: a US Passport, state ID, or driver’s license.

Buy Direction Letter – is an Entrust internal document that clients complete for each outgoing funding to the vendor for an investment

The Gold Money’s fee disclosure – you must provide the signed vendor’s fee disclosure. Please note that the vendor’s fee schedule is separate and independent from the Entrust IRA fee disclosure.  For your convenience, the Gold Money precious metals fee disclosure is attached.

Transfer and Rollover Funds:

Each IRA transfer form(s) must be accompanied with a copy of your current custodian IRA statement(s).  Please complete a separate form for each IRA custodian.  Please note the client’s signature is required on Part 5 and that it is the client’s responsibility to contact the current custodian to liquidate assets for the transfer amount requested on this form.

***Keep in mind that the transfer request can take 2-4 weeks depending on each of the custodians and how quick they send the funds to Entrust.***

Employer plan rollover – if funds are located in a previous employer plan such as a 401k, 403B or 457plan – there are two separate documents you will complete to document the request.

(1) You must contact that current plan administrator to complete their internal “Distribution/Withholding Rollover” form.  Their form may be required to process a direct rollover and you may need to provide the Entrust Administration, Inc. address and account number.   Please have the check issued payable to: Entrust Administration, Inc. FBO the client’s legal name, IRA# ____ AND

(2) Please complete the Entrust form entitled the “Direct Rollover Certification” form.  This form is strictly our internal form to identify that funds will arrive from an employer based retirement plan so we may code them accordingly to the IRS.

Optional forms:

Interested Party Designed form – If a client wishes Entrust to release any information to someone other than the IRA accountholder, the client is required to complete the appropriate section on the “Interested Party Designated/Limited Power of Attorney” form.  This form is attached and requires a medallion signature guarantee or a notary stamp in order to be valid document. Again this form is optional.

Wire instructions

Deposit coupon – to be completed when the client is mailing a physical check as an IRA “contribution” or a “60 rollover” check issued from another retirement plan.  The rollover check must be payable to: Entrust Administration, Inc. FBO your legal name, IRA# ____  (account number will be assigned by Entrust)

Please review and keep the 5305-A IRA disclosure form attached for your records.

For IRA transfers, the current custodian requires the original signed document by mail.  Entrust mails the transfer requests by USPS regular mail.  To expedite the delivery process, the client may provide a pre-labeled courier envelope with the existing IRA custodian’s overnight physical mailing address (please note: overnight packages can not be delivered to a PO Box address). Keep in mind that the transfer request can take 2-4 weeks depending on each of the custodians and how quick they send the funds to Entrust.

Entrust enforces a HOLD policy on funds on both wires and checks.  The check hold policy is 5 business days from the date of deposit into the account.  The hold for an incoming wire is 1 business day.  If the client wishes to have the funds wired requested through the IRA transfer form, Part 4 must be marked on this document and that a $25.00 fee will be deducted from each incoming wire.  Please note that an investment will not be funded until the hold has expired.

To reiterate, it normally takes 2-4 weeks from the initial establishment of the account to receive transfer of funds or rollovers from other institutions and when they become available to utilize towards an investment.   Allow for the 2 business day Entrust review process.  Funding will take place the following business day after completed review.”

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36 comments

ABOUT THE AUTHOR: Trace Mayer, J.D., author of The Great Credit Contraction holds a degree in Accounting, a law degree and studies the Austrian school of economics. He works as an entrepreneur, investor, journalist and monetary scientist. Follow him on Twitter. This is merely one article of 241 by .
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{ 36 comments… read them below or add one }

1 ggaska February 2, 2010 at 7:32 am

Has anybody gone through this process yet? (of establishing a self-directed IRA account with Entrust, in order to place IRA funds into a GoldMoney account)
Any comments on the proceedures/experience?
thanks,
-g.

2 Trace Mayer, J.D. February 2, 2010 at 9:03 am

I have not nor do I know anyone who has. A rather funny coincidence, a couple years ago I was at a family gathering and one of my cousin’s husband (I have 60+ cousins and this was the first time I had ever met this fellow) actually works for Entrust and was in a meeting with the GM people about the IRA product. I could put you in touch with him if you are interested.

3 Jean Sliz September 27, 2010 at 8:08 am

I am concerned on how safe my money will be in the IRA. There is so much deception, dishonesty and fraud in the world. How does this IRA compare to other Gold IRA’s in fees-it seems more expensive than other funds.

Thanks for any other input?!!

4 Trace Mayer, J.D. September 27, 2010 at 8:43 am

I think the fees are pretty high. However, in contrast to the others I would consider GoldMoney to be much more trustworthy and honest with a low probability of any fraud occurring. But there is still the IRA custodian aspect and the government involvement there. With my bullion I want the least amount of layers between me and my assets. Consequently, I neither hold any bullion in an IRA, 401k, etc. nor any other material amounts of assets in them. I do not trust and actually think the retirement plans will be nationalized. I suppose one gets to weigh the risks and rewards.

5 Joe O January 20, 2011 at 11:37 am

I started the process with Entrust but have halted it. I had one Entrust sales rep in Oakland tell me I could manage my goldmoney account like I manage my schwab IRA and then found out later that this is not true. You put in a buy direction letter to purchase and your order gets executed a minimum of 2+ days later because of the backwards way Entrust executes the process so you never know if the price you got is fair with the delay. Also, I have since found out there is an issue with holding physical assets outside the US in an IRA. You may be subject to taking a distribution and penalized by the IRS. I emailed Entrust asking if it is legal to do this and they say they are not a financial advisor and that each individual needs to check with their own CPA. It is a simple yes or no answer. Also, I started looking up review for Entrust Group, the parent company of Entrust and there is a lawsuit against a Robert Bentley I think for defrauding investors by claiming to sell FDIC insured certificates but turned out to be private notes. Entrust is only been doing precious metals since 2008 from what I can find out. I do not know why goldmoney chose what seems to be a questionable company to handle the IRAs. As pointed out also, the fee structure is high. Everyone in the transaction has sticky fingers I’ve found in the murky gold world. I can not find any real ratings of Entrust Group either from most BBB either. If they have been in business for 25+ years, why are there not more BBB ratings on the different sub-companies. It looks like Entrust Group sells franchises to local areas. Now I have to go back to buying paper gold which is really disappointing.

6 Trace Mayer, J.D. January 20, 2011 at 8:17 pm

Hi Joe,

Those are some issues. This is one of the reasons I do not recommend using GoldMoney for IRAs. I not like government retirement plans at all. They have the stickiest fingers of all. I wrote about this issue in-depth in Retirement Accounts Could Boost Treasuries. The main reason to own gold is to reduce risk. Thus, I do not think reducing risk and government retirement plans are compatible concepts. On another note, I do not necessarily think Entrust is quite the culprit you raise issues of. Last I heard they were reorganizing and spinning off, etc. But I have not kept up so I am not sure exactly what the structure is right now. But the fees for a GoldMoney IRA are too high in my opinion.

7 Rob January 25, 2011 at 3:08 am

Joe O, I would like to address some of the issues you have mentioned.

The Bentley case you are referring to has nothing to do with Entrust I think. It concerns a separate company that is not affiliated to Entrust but uses the same name. The Entrust GoldMoney works together with is one of the longest established independent IRA administrators with over 25 years of experience. Alternatively you could work with the IRA department of a bank, not typically something I would advise since the main reason to buy gold is to reduce the dependency on banks.

The overall fee structure of GM may not be the lowest in the market, but for the higher segment (i.e. IRAs above $20k) it is competitive. At least last time I checked.

Cheers,
Rob

8 Trace Mayer, J.D. January 25, 2011 at 8:13 pm

Thanks for the clarification Rob. Sounds like you know more about this area than I do.

9 Joe O January 27, 2011 at 11:38 pm

Here is the website of the SEC fraud investigation naming “Entrust Group” an
IRA custodian as part of the fraud:

http://www.sec.gov/litigation/complaints/complr17298.htm

Can you confirm Rob, that this company is in no way affiliated with the Entrust Group IRA custodian that Goldmoney uses? That would help give me confidence in Entrust as a company. If you work for Entrust, can you briefly describe how the company and affilates are setup? From what I can tell there is an Entrust group parent company and other smaller affiliates with similar names. The websites I was referred to by Entrust for the San Francisco Bay Area are:

http://theentrustgroup.com (seems like the parent company website)
http://entrustcalifornia.com (which points to http://entrustadministration.com)
(seems like an affiliated company)

Also, Rob do you work for Entrust?

My disclosure: I am just an individual trying to move his self-directed (currently schwab) money into gold bullion self-directed IRA preferrably outside the USA.
I do not work for any financial company.

10 Joe O January 27, 2011 at 11:51 pm

I was also hoping to find out if any one knows 100% if gold bullion held in a goldmoney.com account via Entrust self-directed IRA custodian is legal via the
US IRS rules. I have asked my accountant as Entrust told me to do but they do not know. All the marketing material from different self-directed IRA custodian companies such as sterling trust, entrust, etc do not seem to address this issue
and will not provide an answer (all I get is talk to the IRS and your accountant from them).

This is obviously a big issue for us with IRA’s and do not want to be told a year from now that your goldmoney.com IRA is in violation of the IRS rules and now taxable with penalties.

There is suprisingly little information about this on the web. I have looked and looked but can seem to find much at all. From what I’ve found on the web is that
there is a section on the 1040 schedule B in section 3 for foriegn accounts. It seems like Goldmoney.com would meet this criteria. Also reading 1040 schedule B it says that anything over 10,000 has to be reported to the US Treasury on form: “td f 90-22.1″. I’m curious how people are currently doing this with goldmoney.com gold bullion IRAs?

11 Trace Mayer, J.D. January 30, 2011 at 9:20 pm

Joe, the FBAR is a separate issue and I recommend people file an FBAR for their GoldMoney holdings.

I am not really sure on the IRA issue. I am extremely wary of the retirement accounts anyway and do not recommend putting much in any. Just look at Argentina, Turkey, Hungry, etc. for an example of what is likely to happen in the United States.

The issue should not be too difficult for an attorney to research and analyze. I could ask Bill Rounds, who co-authors HowToVanish.com with me, if he would be interested in contacting you to handle this. I have directed many RTG few readers his direction and he has done a great job for them.

12 Rob February 1, 2011 at 1:46 am

Hi Joe,

I don’t work for Entrust, I’m just a happy Goldmoney customer.

I have briefly checked the link http://www.sec.gov/litigation/complaints/complr17298.htm you mentioned. The Entrust mentioned there is a sole proprietorship, registered in Pennsylvania. The Entrust Group GoldMoney works with is http://www.theentrustgroup.com/aboutus/. I think you’re right that The Entrust Group makes use of affiliate offices.

Rob

13 Leo April 20, 2011 at 1:55 pm

I am seriously looking into Goldmoney now because I want to invest in physical gold and silver.

Trace & Rob, how quickly are trades executed when you are directing your funds in Goldmoney without the use of an IRA?

Joe, you said it took over two days for your buy order to fill. That is terrible.

Also, has anyone got updated information on the question Joe asked about owning physical assets outside the U.S. ???

14 Trace Mayer, J.D. April 20, 2011 at 10:35 pm

Leo, the trades are executed extremely quickly given whatever prevailing market conditions and here is GoldMoney’s official policy. If the order are below 2,000 goldgrams, 2,000 silver ounces, 1,000 platinum grams and 1,000 palladium grams per business day then the order is usually immediately locked. If the order is larger than that then the main constraint is only the LBMA and the price volatility is with whatever the Fix price is for that day as GM is going to the actual spot market and buying your physical instead of dealing with a paper instrument like a COMEX future, etc.

15 Leo April 21, 2011 at 9:10 am

Thank you Chase, that is great news. I am excited to open an account with GM. The US is scary and I am really afraid for the long term future of this “once” great country.

16 Joe April 21, 2011 at 9:25 am

Hi Leo,

This is the same Joe as above.

Quick answer to legality of holding IRA outside the US. I hired a lawyer recommended
by Trace and he said, yes, it is legal but you need to file schedule B and the FBAR to disclose foreign accounts. The penalties for not disclosing are huge so make sure you do this because Entrust will not give you any advice on this.

On the trade time via entrust: It took 4 days I think to do paperwork and get the account setup and 2 days before the trade went thru. Make sure you pay attention to the goldmoney rates so that you get the specfied rate (I put in 102,000 in gold just to make sure to get the lower rate). For silver, I bought silver eagles and had entrust store them for about $125/yr fee if I remember in delaware depository because goldmoney silver fees for silver seemed high and I want to split the risk also by diversifying between the US and Goldmoney (outside).

I am not really happy with the service at entrust (they did not answer all my questions and you have to push them to get things done). The problem is they are the only game in town for this (goldmoney; sad). I am looking into an opportunity IRA where I can manage the IRA down the road but this is about $3000 to setup. Another thing to note is that if you have another goldmoney account, you can get a view-only view of your new IRA account via entrust (they have to set it up for you).

Also, since it is reported on schedule B and FBAR, now the goldmoney asset shows up on the IRS and govt lists. This means if you apply for loans where they ask for your tax returns it will probably show up. For example, in a loan mod on a house, they ask for this and it can affect your application.

17 Leo April 21, 2011 at 12:46 pm

Joe, thank you for that very informative reply. You saved me and anyone else reading this much time and expense. I appreciate your valuable time spent on answering my questions.

I cannot believe entrust does not mention the necessity of filing schedule B and the FBAR, especially being that they are located within the US and I imagine cater to mostly domestic investors.

I am going to steer clear of entrust based on your experience and I most likely will directly invest without the aid of any IRA or other retirement account. I don’t like the idea of anyone between me and my precious metal holdings.

I will keep you updated. Thanks again.

18 Trace Mayer, J.D. April 22, 2011 at 10:35 am

Leo, ” I don’t like the idea of anyone between me and my precious metal holdings.” I think your statement hits the nail on the head. Often when I am asked I respond the same way. I really do not understand why people think gold in a retirement plan is a good idea. Retirement accounts will probably be confiscated eventually anyway; assuming you do not count the current confiscation through inflation which is a form of taxation without representation.

19 Joe April 23, 2011 at 10:29 am

Hi Trace and Leo,

I do not want to have my money in an IRA but cashing out now means a
55% loss of the principal. I have accumulated a sum over 20 years so am stuck via a 401k using employer dollars to grow the account. It is better I think to catch the run up in metals during the next crash with twice the money and then let them take whatever tax they are going to apply out of a higher amount.

I and my wife have stopped 401k purchases except to get the employer match (not going to leave money on the table). I put this into PSLV because that is all that is allowed in our 401ks and is the safest I can find in paper metal and Eric Sprott seems to be genuine in reducing counterparty risk.

The money from a previous employer is in a self-directed IRA with entrust w/half in silver coins via delaware depository and half in gold bullion via goldmoney.

Also, just a note, if anyone uses goldmoney IRA or regular accounts, they will need to file an FBAR and schedule B.

20 Leo April 24, 2011 at 11:53 am

Joe, you are definitely doing the right thing for the position you are in. I was just saying for myself, when I start now, having nothing yet set up for a retirement account, which I still need to do outside of this investment. Thanks again for your input and invaluable contribution to this community.

21 Joe October 24, 2011 at 2:25 pm

Wanted to give an update 6 months later on my experience w/entrust.

I recently got an email notice from Entrust stating that I had 60 days to move my goldmoney account to a new trust called HKTC and that if I didn’t they would sell my goldmoney metal and put it back into cash. They didn’t send a written letter and I was lucky I looked in my junk mail folder so I saw this otherwise I would have been cashed out of my goldmoney position without knowing. Very unprofessional.

So, I give them a call after reading the FAQ listed in the email for details and why this decision was made and my questions about the new trust. The first person couldn’t answer my questions so she said I will get a call back from eric on Monday.
I get a call back. This is the same guy I complained to about back in February that it should not take 3 days to execute a buy order and that it was legally questionable why IRA customers were forced to choose the most expensive location for storage (switzerland) of the 3 storage locations goldmoney offers. They guy got defensive and said that’s they way it is done and if I’m not comfortable I should take my business somewhere else. Since there is no other custodian that deals with goldmoney, I stuck it out.

I asked about the new HKTC and said why is it necessary to insert now a 4th company between me and my IRA money. He said it was because people complained about not being able to trade at the current spot price (the same complaint I had 6 months ago and he didn’t answer my question). I then asked him between the 4 entities (entrust, entrust’s bank, HKTC, and goldmoney) if some person in this chain steals the money am I insured for a 100%. Eric gets upset and says this is the same as before (never answer 6 months ago either). Having over 100k and trying to do due dilegence on assessing counterparty risk is not a good question to ask apparently. I also ask about how long HKTC has been in business because the FAQ says the company has ” a proven ability to provide outstanding service”. Answer: 2 weeks. 1st red flag. Another question, FAQ says
“Entrust will continue to handle all reporting requirements on behalf of your IRA holding”. I ask Eric so does Entrust report the FBAR form TD F90-22.1 for my goldmoney account. He gets irritated and says I’m asking obscure legal questions and he has never heard of FBAR and that there is no reporting requirement for foriegn holdings on IRAs according to him. He then said I should mail my questions to the president. I had to ask for his name and address: Jason Craig.

I now have a suspicion of why the HKTC “trust” company was formed by Entrust. I’m guessing it is to limit liability in case Entrust gets in trouble with the treasury and IRS for the FBAR filing so they can point the finger at this “trust” company and keep their other businesses going if that gets into trouble. They never answered my question 6 months ago about the FBAR and said that is a legal question for me discuss with my CPA, IRS, and lawyer. We’ll guess what,

Another issue is that they arbitrarily raised the yearly fee from 150 to 375 for my new force inclusion into HKTC (150%) fee increase and no option to stay in the old structure.
I pointed out to Eric that you don’t need a separate trust company for people to trade in their IRAs since I already have view capability now, that Entrust could simply do this. Another reason why I suspect this is for liability protection and making more income money from their customers.

I have moved my goldmoney holdings to the new trust (basically extortion because I am prevented from taking delivery of metals in IRA and Entrust liquidates after 60 days). I am now looking into self-directed IRA LLCs to get my money the hell out of this bad company. I am stuck for the moment until I set one up.

22 Trace Mayer, J.D. October 24, 2011 at 6:57 pm

Thanks for the update Joe. I will do what I can to look into this.

23 joe October 24, 2011 at 9:21 pm

Your welcome for the update. This is too bad because I really like goldmoney but they have associated themselves with such a dysfunctional custodian company in my opinion. This is the only custodian that I could find that works with goldmoney.

I tried 6 months ago asking a question about delaware depository because I split my money between coins and goldmoney via entrust. I asked them if delaware depository is fully insured against theft, loss, etc. Never could get an answer from entrust. Called delaware depository, they would not give me an answer and told me entrust would have to answer this question. Called first state depository and they told me Delaware is not fully insured. They are insured for something like 75% based on a risk policy with Lloyds of London. If delaware depository blows up or everything disappears, I think my coins will be gone. Trying to get information about counterparty risk and insurance is like pulling teeth. I would have thought by now transparency would be a part of depositories and custodian’s fiduciary responibility to their clients but apparently not. Also, the whole FBAR situation is like a timebomb. I can’t really get a straight answer out anyone. The IRS website states on the FBAR page that: “IRA owners and beneficiaries;” are exempt but the penalty for getting it wrong is unbelievable. I notice that goldmoney still has nothing about FBAR on their site either. I check from time to time. They state the reason is that they can’t put up every countries laws on their website but information like this to me with consequences so dire to their clients should be up there a referral to a person that definitevely knows the answer.

I plan to now form a self-directed IRA LLC after reading up and convert the
goldmoney holding out of this and convert it to coins. I will store the coins in
vaults outside the US to get the same geographical diversification but it is a shame because to me the goldmoney model is simply the best and liquid option.

Self-Directed IRA LLCs have their own pitfalls too I’m finding out. Apparently
there ones run by facilitators and others by tax attorneys. The ones drafted and
defended by tax attorneys are the best in my opinion so far (still investigating).

Would also like to post this link about counterparty risk:

https://goldsilvervault.com/Description_of_Service.html

Interview w/David Morgan and goldsilvervault.com. What I learned in this
video that does not seem to be mentioned on the web anywhere about
counterparty risk is that depositories and vaults insure metal for the current
face value. If the price of silver goes up, the policies only cover the old face value for replacement at most vaults and depositories. Just another non-transparent counterparty risk no one ever talks about. Also, what happens if Lloyds of London gets swamped in a financial crises covering losses like AIG?

Keeping my metal in my possession seems like the safest option more and more.

24 Trace Mayer, J.D. October 29, 2011 at 11:55 pm

“Trying to get information about counterparty risk and insurance is like pulling teeth.”

No kidding! I had one reader that hired Bill Rounds, a CA attorney who runs HowToVanish.com with me, to fly up to Canada and inspect the legal documents because the company would not let the client have copies and would not send copies to Bill. He had to read the documents in their room. Talk about ridiculous.

GoldMoney is not going to put up information about the FBAR, etc. or make recommendations for services firms as that could get very messy. What their customers pay them for, and I think they do an excellent job at, is to buy physical gold, put it on a trust, take it to a vault and guard it along with allowing them to use it as currency by transferring it to other people. If you want information about the FBAR or some other country’s laws then it is best to hire competent counsel like Bill. There has been significant discussion in the various comments on this site about the FBAR and the general consensus is to report.

The insurance company could go down but as long as the insured interest has not been affected then it is not that huge of a deal. For example, you could have your house uninsured for a few days and the probability of it burning down, etc. in those few days is very low. But it is not very comforting!

As far as IRAs, 401Ks and other government sponsored retirement plans go I just stay away from them. Strings are attached and the last thing I want strings attached to is my bullion. Good luck, there is no free lunch.

25 Ryan Renolds December 9, 2011 at 4:32 pm

I think that GoldMoney’s decision to partner with one specific IRA provider (Entrust Administration) was a horrible decision. I had my self-directed IRA with the Entrust Office out of Colorado and I was FORCED to move my account to the office in California. My fees from the Colorado office were much less and honestly, the service from the Colorado office was MUCH MUCH better. I decided to liquidate my holdings with GoldMoney and switch to BullionVault.

Warning, if you’re considering Entrust Administration, don’t think twice. AVOID THEM! Their service and in my opinion, ethics, is pretty concerning. I always got the feeling that they were out to get me on fees.

26 Trace Mayer, J.D. December 10, 2011 at 8:36 am

Ryan, thanks for the feedback. I have also thought their fees were pretty high. Then again, I think holding gold in one’s IRA or other ‘government sponsored account’ is a bad idea anyway. The precious metals act as insurance and if they are in those accounts then they have strings attached. I do not want any strings attached to my bullion. I want it to stand independent.

27 Sam December 26, 2011 at 10:36 am

Another good discussion….Joe has answered my question from earlier today on the main page….I will not invest my IRA with GM through Entrust.

On another note, I am hesitant to cash out and pay the penalty and tax on my IRA, so, I am looking for the best way to direct it. What is the downside to investing it with an ETF such as SGOL, PHYS, or IAU? I am not considering GLD…..

I realize the govt can pass a law to do anything, including IRA confiscation……but, it can also pass a law to confiscate what is buried in my backyard as well

28 Trace Mayer, J.D. December 26, 2011 at 11:38 pm

Sam, I suppose it would be easier to get it in the IRA than out of your backyard. I think requiring a certain portion of IRAs, 401Ks, etc. to be in ‘safe and secure’ investments like Treasuries is a more likely outcome like I wrote in Retirement Accounts Could Boost Treasuries. If you go for an ETF then I would stay away from GLD and get Sprott’s.

29 Susan January 16, 2012 at 11:07 pm

Just curious, did anyone ever find a solution outside of US? I found this, which looks legit:

http://www.globalgold.ch/

Wondering if anyone has any thoughts on the matter? I am leaving my current employer and have about 45K in the 401K and 10K in the IRA. I would like to roll over into some kind of fund outside the US, preferably in Switzerland, but doesn’t have to be gold/metals. I have many other connections there, and will likely retire there, so would like to cover the currency risk as well as start the nest egg for future. Thanks!

30 Jacob Wright January 28, 2012 at 11:43 pm

I would suggest checking out New Direction IRA. They’re based out of Colorado and just did a guest talk on a BullionVault webinar about self directed IRA investing. Their website is http://www.newdirectionira.com. I was looking into GoldMoney vs BullionVault and New Direction IRA only changes $150/year for administration for the BullionVault account. That’s half of what Entrust wanted. Plus…. Google Entrust Scam and you’ll see they’ve been involved in all kinds of law suits… Just my $.02 and experience… Good luck!

31 Rich February 3, 2012 at 8:27 pm

Sweet feedback, excellent information, thanks to all. My experience with gold money has been good, although I know people overseas that can help me with taxes etc… if I need it. Keep in mind everything foreign, is very foreign to the U.S.A. way of doing business. I won’t establish a foreign IRA. I am researching IRA’s at the Gold Star Trust Company in Texas, any info anyone has would be appreciated. Who can you really trust, so diversify your holdings in many ways.

One friendly neighbor of the U.S.A. (Canada), has a couple of funds I know of (maybe more). CEF (Central Fund of Canada Limited) holds gold and silver, and GTU (Central Gold Trust) holds gold. If you want an alternative to GLD, SLV or IAU you owe it to yourself to check these out. Generally speaking Canada doesn’t have as much political and fiscal risk as other foreign countries, and if you have an issue and need a “face to face” encounter you can go there and sort it out. Statistics are always biased to the audience that they are presented to, but generally the Canadian government debt is nowhere near the bad shape of the U.S. Federal government debt. Canada is a good boring country to place some investments.

32 Mike Villegas June 10, 2012 at 7:52 pm

I want t get started on an Ira . Can I put different types of gold and silver in it? Or does it have to be all bullion proofs?

33 Franny July 19, 2012 at 3:46 pm

Mike you can put any pure bullion silver or gold bars or coins in an IRA, but not junk 90% silver. The only non-pure gold allowed are American Gold Eagles. No krugs. I use New Direction and First State Depository and have been happy with the service and pricing.

34 John Fortuno September 17, 2012 at 12:02 pm

Entrust was recently blocked and fined by the Commodities and Futures Trading Commission to cease and desist doing business with all futures companies. What else do you need to know?????????

35 John December 14, 2012 at 10:43 am

I am considering trading through Bullion Vault. Any drawbacks ? Thanks

36 Trace Mayer, J.D. December 17, 2012 at 1:24 pm

John, BullionVault seems to have a great system with low fees for trading. But the ETFs might been even cheaper. If all you want it exposure to the metal prices and are not worried about removing the counter-party risk, etc. then I think either BullionVault or the ETFs would be a good tool to trade with.

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