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apmex

Glenn Beck Goldline Apmex And Gainesville Coins

by Trace Mayer, J.D. on May 27, 2010 · 56 comments

Reading time: 6 – 10 minutes

While gold, silver and platinum are risk-free the precious metals industry contains both sterling actors and unscrupulous shysters. All are trying to make a profit which, if done morally, is commendable. The Glenn Beck and Goldline issue raised by Mr. Weiner is nonsense. But as a purchaser I want to get the best value. Oftentimes an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

After thorough research I am confident you will find the best value with Apmex for the vast majority of transactions and get more ounces than when buying from any competitors like Gainesville Coins, Goldline or Apmex.

GLENN BECK AND REPRESENTATIVE WEINER

Representative Anthony Weiner was first elected in 1998 to the New York 9th District and roosts on the Energy and Commerce committee and Judiciary committee. His top campaign contributor is ActBlue at $44,500 and his #2 campaign contributor is M&R Management with $19,200. ActBlue describes themselves as ‘the nation’s largest source of funds for Democrats’.

CBS News recently reported,

Weiner accused Beck and other conservative spokespeople (among them Mark Levin and Fred Thompson) of using “their shows to prey on the public’s fears of inflation and socialist takeovers while actively promoting the purchase of gold coins as insurance against this purported government overreach.” …

Weiner, who is on the House Subcommittee on Commerce, Trade and Consumer Protection, says Beck “should be ashamed of himself.” He has written letters to the SEC and FTC asking them to investigate Goldline and is proposing legislation to force the company to “fully disclose their dishonest business practices” by showing consumers “their astronomical markups, and deceitful promises of profitability.”

Mr. Weiner may want to tame his defamatory tongue where he is asserting that Goldline engages in ‘dishonest business practices’ and ‘deceitful promises’. If these assertions are false and a reasonable investigation would cause the reasonable person to conclude that Goldline were not involved in dishonest business practices or deceitful promises then Goldline should consider suing Mr. Weiner for defamation. Think of all the free publicity!

After a reasonable investigation the facts appear to reveal that Goldline’s customers are pleased with the company’s business practices and there appears to be no evidence of anyone, besides Mr. Weiner who is probably not a Goldline customer anyway, claiming that Goldline has acted in a dishonest or unscrupulous way.

But perhaps this is to be expected language from those defaming ilk like Mr. Weiner. Where does ActBlue get their funding? One example is Martin Matthews the Director of Government Affairs for Merck & Co. who gave ActBlue $750. And what does Merck & Co. do for business?

On 6 October 2004 The Wall Street Journal reported,

Merck & Co.’s arthritis drug Vioxx may have led to more than 27,000 heart attacks and sudden cardiac deaths before it was pulled from the market last week … citing a study by the Food and Drug Administration, said that from Vioxx’s approval in 1999 through 2003, an estimated 27,785 heart attacks and sudden cardiac deaths

WebMD Health News citing a recent study published in the Archives Of Internal Medicine asserts ‘Merck should have known Vioxx was deadly years before they pulled the drug from the market, a study of Merck’s own data suggests.” And where did those profits from Merck’s sale of Vioxx go? Into Mr. Weiner’s campaign pocketbook. And how does he use them? As a bully pulpit against profitable companies with a sterling BBB reputation.

GOLD AND SILVER DEALER REVIEW

best value being (1) credible and reputable and (2) having the best prices.

While I consider RunToGold a fun hobby I also require it to be self-sufficient since that is the only way to ensure it will be sustainable. While it is fun I will not allow it to be black hole on my balance sheet. Fortunately, sales of The Great Credit Contraction and donations from readers like you have been sufficient to provide for the thousands of dollars of cash costs associated with its operation. Free speech can be quite expensive!

Over the years with RunToGold I have been approached by many gold and silver dealers, including Goldline, about advertising but I never found the right fit. While I had my own sources for purchasing bullion, not numismatic coins, and I recommended those companies when asked; for the most part I have shied away from publicly endorsing any particular company besides GoldMoney because to do so requires me to stake some creditability and why should I?

But I am finding that many readers are reporting back to me with both good and bad accounts of interactions with gold and silver dealers. Consistent with the ounce of prevention rule I have undertaken to pool the collective experiences of my readers along with my own so that I can direct new readers who decide on buying gold, silver and platinum towards a provider that offers the best value being (1) credible and reputable and (2) having the best prices. This is an example of what I found:

APMEX OR GAINESVILLE COINS REVIEW?

So who is Apmex? I have ordered from them for years now. They have been in business for over 30 years, have extremely competitive prices and an A+ BBB rating.

My Gainesville Coins review distinguishes their service from others by them being a fairly new gold and silver dealer. Although new they have a good reputation and happy customers. I have made significant orders from them and been satisfied.

CONCLUSION

Owning gold, silver and platinum is something every responsible person should do. When deciding who to buy bullion from I can now confidently recommend Apmex if you want possession or GoldMoney if you want a third-party storage service. I think both forms are wise.

Additionally, I would shy away from taking any advise from Mr. Weiner. So long as the transaction is voluntary, unlike those Mr. Weiner engages in like voting YES on the Health Care Bill to give Merck more money from involuntary premiums, I am more concerned with the number of ounces the buyer gets. With Apmex I am confident you will, in the vast majority of transactions, get more ounces than when buying from any competitors. Of course, do your own due diligence.

DISCLOSURE: Long physical gold, silver and platinum with no interest the murderous Merck (MRK), problematic SLV or GLD ETFs or the platinum ETFs.

ANTHONY WEINER
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56 comments

ABOUT THE AUTHOR: Trace Mayer, J.D., author of The Great Credit Contraction holds a degree in Accounting, a law degree and studies the Austrian school of economics. He works as an entrepreneur, investor, journalist and monetary scientist. Follow him on Twitter. This is merely one article of 242 by .
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{ 55 comments… read them below or add one }

1 Debra May 27, 2010 at 11:01 pm

I would like to recommend California Numismatic Investments (www.golddealer.com). I have made three separate bullion purchases from them in the last year and have been very positively impressed. Their prices are competitive, actually among the lowest I found, PLUS the shipping and insurance are free, which makes the total cost less than any other dealer I considered. They have an A rating with the BBB and only 2 (appropriately resolved) complaints in the last 3 years. Their people are very friendly, helpful and efficient; and each of my purchases arrived within a few days of payment. Please check them out and include them in your recommendations if you can. Thank you.

2 T-dog May 28, 2010 at 12:19 am

I’ve also dealt with CNI (California Numismatic Investments) and I was happy with them as well. If you are picking up product the neighborhood ain’t Sesame street that’s for sure. I looked into Goldline to check prices after I heard of this “scandal” but they seemed competitive on 1 0z bullion AE’s and silver bullion as well.

Well folks, what specific coins did Senator Weiner have issues with?? I want to know. I looked at the complaint and it stated that a 1-0z bullion coin was marked up 28% over melt value. Is melt value the same as spot price?? Have they changed since this all went public? I’m interested in doing business with them. Thanks for the Gainsville coins info.

Hey Trae, did you catch Senator Weiner on O’Reilly??? O’Reilly asks why he didn’t investigate MONEX since they have an “F” rating. That was SWEET!!!!!

3 andy b May 28, 2010 at 2:02 am

Peter Schiff had an interview the other day where he beat up on Goldline too. His main charge is that the customer reps guide uneducated costumers into smaller size European coins which have huge markups, sometimes getting 30% to 50% over spot. He had some of his staff call Goldline to make his findings. I suppose if you call them up and ask them for exactly what you want eg a bullion coin without much markup, and you can talk your way through, you get what you’re after. Their website is deceiving in that you have to work your way around to find any low markup bullion coins. They push “collector” value. Really a terrible website compared to others out there…

4 Trace Mayer, J.D. May 28, 2010 at 4:25 pm

andy b, I do not really have an issue with the higher premiums, etc. so long as it is a transparent and voluntary transaction. I have purchased several coins at substantial premiums, like a large Australian Dragon which is beautiful, but it is because I wanted them and consider it art like a pretty necklace. But if one wants bullion to preserve wealth, and bullion coins can still be petted also, then I think the lowest premium possible is the goal because it is ounces one is most concerned with, not design, art, etc. I think a lot of new bullion investors get pushed into numismatics which is, in my opinion, not a good idea so long as one wants bullion to preserve wealth.

5 andy b May 28, 2010 at 2:06 am

Thanks Trace for the Gainsville recommendation. I had sent this name, after doing research, to my aunt who was inquiring about gold. I’ll send her the “shipping” possible deal.

6 silver guy May 28, 2010 at 3:30 am

I have been buying from Monex for 6 years for Physical ….and trading silver and gold contracts on Trade Station for Profit ..(until last year you could not take delivery on the Mini….although now you can if you trade the fiffe mini silver..ship to golden state mint in Redlands CA and convert to rounds at .75c each , including insurance and shipping from exchange and back to you. .. recently David Morgan recommend this method using Golden State ; …. buying 1,000 oz bars at spot and shipping to Golden State mint for conversion to coins, ( you are getting .999 coins for .75c net over spot!!!!) ….. Now back to Monex the negitive rating is due to people buying on Margin…too much margin ! (it has been reported that 90% of all commodity traders go broke the first year!…and Silver is the most difficult of all to trade). I recommend Monex with the caveat USE VERY LITTLE MARGIN they offer 25% down …use 50% max…and that only on major dips… don’t get greedy …take delivery. …. My deliveries from Monex…were prompt… took around 2 weeks, … Registered insured Priority mail itself takes 10 days. ….When I order a check from my Monex equity they send it out that day. On at least 10 occasions I have ordered a check from monex on fri. afternoon (Newport CA) and It was in my Florida mail box on Monday morning!!!!! Monex is Great …the only problem is greedy margin buyers, Your ratings are misleading and obviously self serving ..also you are wrong about priceing on the internet you can get up to the second!!! quotes on all Monex precious metal products. at http://www.monex.com…..I don’t expect you will post this comment

7 Dewald May 28, 2010 at 6:24 am

After I ordered some coins from Gainesville I am realy glad to read this endorsement. Will in future use the runtogold discount code!
Thanks

8 falling knife May 28, 2010 at 3:38 pm

I don’t know why you’ve listed prices at Monex as N/A, all you have to do is go to their website and prices are updated every minute. Closing spot price of gold was 1214.00 and gold eagles 1268.50 on Fri. 5/28. Since Monex clients have leveraged accounts, alot of people got burned with margin calls when silver dove 60% a year and a half ago. I’m sure enough people didn’t take the responsibility for their over-leveraged positions and whined to the BBB when Monex wouldn’t cover their mistake, accounting for the “F”. I haven’t experienced any problem with product delivery. On the other hand, as to what might happen with bullion if exchanges default from too many delivery orders, I’ll let someone else address that scenario.

9 Trace Mayer, J.D. May 28, 2010 at 4:21 pm

I listed the prices as N/A because I was unable to figure out how to get the coins in a shopping cart where it would only take one click to confirm the order and have the price locked in. I did find what appears to be prices on http://www.monex.com/liveprices but not the ability to place an order. Perhaps the prices are available but the website usability is rather poor?

I must admit I have not spent much time on the various bullion dealer’s websites. I was surprised at the poor quality of a lot of them and did not include them in the analysis because they were likewise poor in usability. Additionally, if I cannot figure it out it makes me wonder how useful they would be to one of my readers. I generally consider myself pretty technically savvy and have even read a few books on website usability (I hope RunToGold is easy to use! Please let me know if anything could be improved.)

10 Ray May 28, 2010 at 6:07 pm

I have bought about 200 1 oz gold Maple leafs and 1000 of 1 oz silver Maple leafs from Goldline over the last 6 months. I did my research before I bought and I told them exactly what I wanted. They did try to sell me swiss gold francs, but I wasn’t having any! I did compare with Gainsville Coins about 4 months ago and found their spot price about $15 per the aforementioned gold difference. But lately the spread between Gainsville and Goldline has dropped to about $3 to $5 with Gainsville lower. I still like Goldline. Monex is so out of sight for the same coins….

11 T-dog May 29, 2010 at 4:42 am

Good info Ray.

I wonder if Goldline is more competitive now that they are in the spotlight. I can’t even find the prices on the web site.

I wonder if the issue here is that the coin dealers can’t make good money just selling bullion coins. I don’t know I’m just speculating.

Guys here is a list of dealers I have or would buy from. Can you guys give me an opinion??

1. Gainsville Coins
2. CNI
3 Rocklin Coin Shop/JH Mint
4. Investment Rareties
5. Goldline

12 Ray May 29, 2010 at 4:55 am

Reply to T-dog:

I guess I should have made it a little clearer in my comment that Gainsville Coins has reduced the spread between Goldline by raising their prices(Gainsville)….

13 silver guy May 29, 2010 at 5:48 am

To the Guy with the Post above:…….I went to Goldlines web site and could not find any quotes I spent 20 minutes clicking all over the site …. I went to the Monex site… without any clicks at all …the prices for everything is in front of your face ….Silver&Gold : …..Eagles…Maple Leafs…Philharmonics……….Gold: Buffalos…Krugerrands……90% and 40% junk silver bags……Palladium and Platinum coins ……and all the bullion metals ….(1,000 oz Silver bar quotes are : $0.14 over spot …premium for 100 bars vary 25c to 50c over the 1,000 oz quote)….. you order by picking up the telephone …..as I said previously don’t buy on margin unless you know what you are doing (they will try and talk you into an Atlas account : (Margin) to go this route you must do your due diligence DAILY!!!…..don’t go for 25%margin…50% max ….and only on dips ..so you can lock in a price for later delivery, when you can come up with the funds…(not too much later) . in conclusion I have not found any dealers cheaper than Monex ; there premium on Silver Eagles is currently $1.95… There Premium on 90% junk silver is $0.12 ….they do not sell rounds…..Golden State mint in Florida and Redlands Calif. is the best I have found; .999 Silver Buffalos for .75c over spot (including shipping & insurance.

14 silver guy May 29, 2010 at 5:57 am

to : T-DOG………..your Number 3 on the list ….Rockin/JH mint (jason Hommel) …you cannot find a more honest company…but at a premium price … I have found there premiums to often be double that of Monex… and they buy many of there rounds from Golden State Mint with a hefty markup

15 T-dog May 29, 2010 at 2:21 pm

Yeah silver guy I know. I have bought from JH before at the money show once, and I was happy with the price (after he lowered the price). The irony is that I bought from CNI primarily because of his recommendation (before he had a coin shop and mint). I like the guy though but I’m trying to get the most product for my dollars. JH is pretty cool …a little weird too but if his prices were in line and I didn’t mind getting the product via mail I’d probably would give him my business. A few visits with him might be like getting a Master’s degree in Ag….not to mention the bible credits.

I’ve also noticed that Investment Rareties have been around a long time. I don’t believe their prices are the lowest. I noticed them because I signed up for some newsletter at the Money show and they gave a 1 oz silver walking liberty by doing so. I thought that was strong. They are not local to me though.

So are some companies using their bullion products as a sort of loss leader to get people in the door and then steering these people to higher markup products?? Is there any money for these guys in just selling bullion products??

16 andy b May 29, 2010 at 3:34 pm

I want to put in a plug for getting to know your local dealer.

I have one in my town who is great: you can go down, shoot the bull, handle the product, and the prices–both buying and selling (at least for a few coins or bars)–are better than mail order, even before postage. He, by the way, says he’s had to disappoint Goldline buyers by informing them that the high mark-uped item they purchased has much less “collector value” than they were led to believe (and paid). That is something he’s delt with when sellers come in…Thanks again to all who have posted good references for mail order.

17 Debra May 29, 2010 at 8:45 pm

I appreciate Andy’s plug for getting to know your local dealer. I’d much prefer to work with a dealer face-to-face than long distance. If anyone knows a reputable dealer in the Denver, Colorado area, I’d be very interested in a referral. I’m also curious how the prices (mark up) in face-to-face transactions compare to what’s available on the internet (aside from shipping/insurance, of course). Anyone know about that?
Thanks to all.

18 T-dog May 30, 2010 at 4:06 pm

Debra,

Through my own experience many local coin dealers are competitive on gold bullion coins but not so much as far as silver goes. If you are just buying a coin or two every so often then a local dealer is the way to go. Check out on-line prices of other dealers
before you go and stick with bullion.

19 Ray May 30, 2010 at 4:49 pm

Ahhh! I finally found the new Goldline link for internet purchases anyway: http://goldlinecoins.stores.yahoo.net/index.html Of course as with Gainsville purchases with a credit card the prices are what I think of as a little out of sight(spread over spot)! I price 1 oz gold maple leafs .9999 fine usually as a base. Goldline was $50.00 over spot on a bank wire funds transfer when I buy. They seem to have taken down the non-internet purchase prices….. Goldline on large purchases does not charge shipping and insurance ($40) as Gainsville always does. Small savings…. Orders over $2500 you should speak to an account executive as distastfull as that sounds. But I found them very knowledgable and freindly. I am not on the Goldline payroll either :)

20 T-dog May 31, 2010 at 3:01 pm

Ray,

I don’t think that is the same site. I know it reads Gold line International but it is a different http address. How did you get to the site??

21 T-dog May 31, 2010 at 3:06 pm

Ray,

My bad it is the correct site. Tell me if I’m wrong but the prices seem to suck.

22 Ray May 31, 2010 at 4:06 pm

T-dog, goto http://www.goldline.com/ and at the very bottom of the page is a link called ‘online store’. That took me to the URL I posted previously. The prices ‘suck’ obviously. Using credit cards on Gainsville also is a lot higher price. Using a credit card has its penalty. That is why I always bank wire funds. Credit cards could be considered ‘cash’ and hence possibly subject to 1099b type reporting. I am not sure about that though! Remember cash transactions trigger 1099b reporting to the feds. I like to keep a low profile if possible….

23 Ray May 31, 2010 at 4:15 pm

As an addemum to the previous post, spot gold is $1216.7 right now. Gainsville bank wire price for 1 oz maple leafs is 1262.45 wich is a pread of $45.75. Credit card for the same is $1296.17 and a spread of $80.47. So you can see the disadvantage of using credit cards to make purchases. Right now Goldline online store is quoting $1325/ 1 oz maple leafs. I sure wouldn’t buy there. Spread is $109. Yikes! Everyone needs to ‘shop around’… Actually play one off against another with prices, like ‘well Gainsville price is XXXXX’.

24 Doug Eberhardt May 31, 2010 at 4:56 pm

Hi Trace,

Enjoy reading your site and I think your advice is “spot on” for the most part. I read your book The Great Credit Contraction and agree with most of what you write. For $10 how could one not buy it?

I believe with this article you have characterized the intent of Representative Weiner well, in connecting his Leftists views and prior/current relationships. However, his comments characterizing Goldline are closer to the truth than most realize.

How do I know this? I worked for Goldline.

I am finishing my book that does expose the gold dealer industry for what it is with the goal of educating the potential gold buyer. While I agree with the philosophy of a “transparent and voluntary transaction” in a free market world, most people who call in and talk to a gold dealer for the first time have no clue as to what they are getting themselves into. The reason IMO, Goldline hasn’t received a ton of complaints like Monex (although Monex complaints are for different reasons as you know) is because those who bought the European gold coins haven’t sold them yet.

People may call in and ask how their gold investment is doing, but their broker will give them the “current” price, not the buyback price.

Also, the fees are not disclosed to a buyer at Goldline by the representative on the phone who does the selling, unless asked by the caller, but are only disclosed in a rapid fire manner by the person who does the confirmation of the trade. After the confirmation, the sales rep gets back on the phone, thanks them and the deal is done.

The ignorance of the general public is appalling when it comes to buying gold and many gold dealers take advantage of this ignorance (Ignorance defined as, “they don’t know what they don’t know.”). I expose their tactics in my book.

I’ve been writing articles on my blog in refuting the ignorance of CFP’s, CFA’s, journalists, etc. but haven’t gone after the gold dealers yet. I was in the process of doing so when the Weiner/Beck drama surfaced.

That’s why I’m taking the time off now to get the truth out to the public. While I am not yet set up to do so, I will be selling gold and silver bullion based on the recommendations and strategies included in my book through my gold sales company in the near future (website forthcoming). I plan on being the Walmart to the industry, offering investors in gold and silver bullion the lowest premium to spot I can while eeking out a small percentage.

Yes, there are a few companies out there who are good. Unfortunately, most of the advertisements people hear on the radio and TV don’t lead them to the good ones and direct them to those who sell the wrong type of gold investment.

I hope my book wakes the industry up for the betterment of all. If it works, right AND left wing radio will have to find different advertisers!

I’ll send you a free copy of my book once I’m finished. It’s called “Buy Gold and Silver Safely.” I may actually call you next week for permission to use your updated Exter’s pyramid. Perhaps I could quote you on the inflation/deflation debate related to gold if you’re willing.

Thanks for listening…

25 Dirk May 31, 2010 at 6:57 pm

Re; T-dog May 29, 2010 (2 days ago) at 4:42 am
Good info Ray.

I wonder if Goldline is more competitive now that they are in the spotlight. I can’t even find the prices on the web site.

I wonder if the issue here is that the coin dealers can’t make good money just selling bullion coins. I don’t know I’m just speculating.

Guys here is a list of dealers I have or would buy from. Can you guys give me an opinion??

1. Gainsville Coins I have used and will again. Good service, Fair pricing
2. CNI No opinion, Have not used
3 Rocklin Coin Shop/JH Mint Fair and Honest. Will use again
4. Investment Rareties Pricing seems high, Have not used
5. Goldline No opinion, Have not used
Good comments on your local coin dealer. Face to Face is a plus.
I like both APMEX and Bullion Direct. They both have easy to navigate web-sites with the nod to APMEX and pricing and shipments have always been excellent with some timely specials to boot.
Good Luck!

26 T-dog June 1, 2010 at 2:50 pm

thanks Dirk, I forgot about APMEX

27 T-dog June 1, 2010 at 11:19 pm

What is Bullion Direct and how does it compare to other dealers?

28 Dirk June 2, 2010 at 8:04 am

T-dog—————–
Bullion Direct is an online Retailer similar to APMEX. http://www.bulliondirect.com/
In my opinion pricing is solid and service is excellent.
They have an interesting feature that I have not used but people have spoken highly of called the Neuclo Exchange. Best to do your own due dilligence but in short it’s a precious metals account where you buy the actual metal and can use this account to store the metal until you want it shipped or sell back at any time.
I know many in the PM world are very nervous about these “accounts” but my understanding is they are not pooled accounts but your individual PM accounts filled with the exact items you purchase. 50 Gold Eagles, 10 Engelhard 100 ounce bars, a Monster Box of Silver Eagles. Whatever.
I’m a buy and receive it type but some like to trade in and out so it’s an option without shipping back and forth.
Something to look at but I have always been pleased when dealing with them.

29 Radek June 2, 2010 at 1:08 pm

Hi,

Peter Schiff holds quite a different view.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GJNRdIoStk&feature=youtube_gdata

best,
Radek

30 kumanari June 2, 2010 at 10:01 pm

I am a FORMER customer of Goldline and I concur with Doug Eberhardt. Though not illegal their practices are not quite moral. They charge way high premiums on certain coins and attempt to steer customers to the highest premium products through deception, fear, and other nefarious means. They take advantage of their customers ignorance much like the subprime industry. Weiner’s actions are much like Goldlines, not illegal but they will bring notice to their unsavory practices. Please note just because they have no complaints or lawsuits and have a high rating (can you say Moody’s/S&P) mean little. They were charging spot plus $19.95/oz-coin for ag when I did business in 06, I wasn’t that dumb. I was told the $19.95/oz-coin for au plus spot would always be in effect not so in’10. Many dealers will try to scare you with the “buy numis-confiscation” line which is total bull no one turned their coins in anyways and they were allowed to keep $100 worth. No one was jailed or prosecuted. 2010 no one owns gold now and those that do won’t turn it in. Our world is changing, honesty, ethics and morals will be highly valued as it always has for us true humans. I use ICA the only ones I found to deliver (ag) without excuses/lies when others had a six month/week wait in 06.
a hui hou, malama pono

31 Steve July 1, 2010 at 1:08 pm

APMEX- In the last two years I have purchased 09 monster box’s S.E. and a number of monster box’s 2010 S.E. and a lot of Gold Eagles. There service has always been outstanding.Have been buying bullion since 1998 from a number of companys but they are the best. If you can’t show your prices than I just go on to the next dealer. Fast service,e-mails to tell me were my order is and no B.S. do not buy other countrys bullion(not true 1/4oz. .2354 oz.) If the S__T hits the fan only coins in oz.1/10-1/4-1/2 or 1 will work in Ameraca.

32 Debra July 1, 2010 at 5:05 pm

Hi Trace. I’m concerned about Steve’s (immediately above) final comment about only American coins working in America after the S__T hits the fan. I’ve never heard this before and have a significant collection of Philharmonics. Would you please share with all your readers whether there’s any validity to Steve’s advice, so that we will know to avoid other countries’ coins if their liquidity is likely to be limited to any extent. Thanks.

33 Trace Mayer, J.D. July 1, 2010 at 5:30 pm

Hi Debra, I do not think the issue Steve raises is, presently, very material. If the American economy begins using gold and silver coins on a regular basis and if that transition happens quickly such as a hyperinflation then we will likely have larger problems to deal with than the issue of what is stamped on the gold and silver coins being used such as getting food on the supermarket shelves and reasons addressed in Survivalism In The Suburbs. However, if the transition happens over a gradual period then this could be an issue because the foreign stamped coins do not carry the same legal tender privileges as the US coins. Already there are advantages to using the US coins as opposed to Euro coins like the Philharmonics and I addressed this in Define The Dollar Or Else. Because there are these advantages to US coins I recommend them and in my own case it is what I mostly use.

34 Debra July 2, 2010 at 7:15 pm

Hi, Trace. Thank you for your response, however little comfort it may be. All of my other bullion is 1 oz. bars, which wouldn’t be any more legal tender than the Philharmonics. I chose these on the advice that the less processing the bullion has had the cheaper it should be, without thought to ever parting with them other than by selling them back to a dealer. I guess I’ll have to do that some time BEFORE the S__T hits the fan. Hope there will be adequate warning time. Anyway, thanks for your advice, which I will follow if I decide to buy any more. Hope you have a good holiday weekend. GOD BLESS AMERICA.

35 Trace Mayer, J.D. July 2, 2010 at 9:36 pm

Hi Debra, I do not think there is an issue with 1oz bars as opposed to coins if there is a serious problem. The legal tender coins are merely helpful in the meantime. If you are holding the metal for a long time then bullion bars are just fine. I own plenty of that also. The one type I would avoid is numismatic coins. Happy 4th!

36 jube July 19, 2010 at 11:24 am

Dont Purchase from these clowns…

3 different times i attemted to make purchases with GainesvilleCoins.com, Just at the end of the checkout process, it gives me an “ERROR” and says my order was not processed.
Then I have to get on the phone with my bank to find out why… My bank tells me the purchase was APPROVED and that the funds are on hold.. after calling G.Coins, they cant figure it out, and tell me that there side didnt approve it.. WTF? ok so, im not getting my “Locked in Price” im not getting my Order, yet my funds are on hold? Then They tell me they can take the order by phone, so I give them all my info.. they give me a Confirmation Number and then I get nothing!! Then when I leave them messages I get no response.. EPPIC FAIL! will never purchase from them again.

37 Tom P September 25, 2010 at 12:53 pm

I have bought gold, silver and platinum for the past 10 years, and I have dealt with Monex but I must say that they remind me of Goldline a bit, but I have settled down to 3 dealers and I buy regularly and these 3 have serviced the heck out of me in those 10 years.
Gainesville, NYPMEX and CNI are the tops in the precious metals business in my book. Each have their qualities, Gainesville has a huge selection probably one of the largest, NYPMEX while not as large a selection has even cheaper prices on many items and ships insured quickly. CNI has awesome service and great articles while still being very competitive . They are the top three in our view.

38 Sophie's Mom October 3, 2010 at 1:16 pm

An elderly relative who is a fan of Glenn Beck took his advice and called Goldline. By the time we found out it was too late. She had no idea what she was doing. She purchased 20K in collector coins. We researched what she bought. She was totally taken to the cleaners. Their practices may not be illegel but totally immoral. Glenn Beck should be ashamed of himself. There are people who trust him.

39 Trace Mayer, J.D. October 4, 2010 at 10:33 am

That is a horrible story. I do not like the collector coins because the premiums are rather high and the liquidity is lower than the general bullion coins. I think many of the bullion dealers try to sell them because of the higher margins. I suppose it is important for the customer to be properly educated and not just run off like a hypnotized lemming doing whatever the TV, website, etc. ‘programs’ them to do.

40 Doug Eberhardt October 4, 2010 at 11:08 am

Hi Trace,

I’ve been writing quite a bit on this lately. In case you didn’t know, Anthony Weiner’s office wanted me to testify before Congress on Sept. 23 at the gold dealer hearings, and then when my book was sent off to the Energy and Commerce committee, they decided to pass on my testimony. I guess they didn’t like what was written in the first four chapters, ha… (readers of this please note I quoted Trace Mayer’s book, “The Great Credit Contraction” which I recommend everyone pick up a copy).

The article I just published is Beware; the European Gold Coin Rip-off – Swiss Franc, French Rooster, British Sovereign

http://buygoldandsilversafely.com/gold/beware-the-european-gold-coin-rip-off-swiss-franc-french-rooster-british-sovereign/

Yes, there is a plug for my company and book in that article. I know there is enough business to go around, and you know from reading my book that I recommend other reputable gold companies, just as you do. We just want an educated investor.

I’ve decided to come out against the industry more and have been exposing their tactics on my site.

Hope you’re well…

41 art December 17, 2010 at 9:27 am

i’m with debrah at the top of the page folks. CNI was recommended to me by a friend about three years ago. as of today 90% of my prescious metals are from them for their no non sense approach, price and customer service. anyone you speak to is a winner over there with the exception of one dude….sal.
merry Christmas and blessings to all!

42 Bad experience December 22, 2010 at 6:44 pm

I tried to buy some Gold from Gainsville coins recently and have had the worst buying experience ever. Not only was my credit card charged right away but I spent 2 weeks in phone calls and trying to contact them about when my product would ship. Each time I was told there is no problem and it would ship right away. Finally I am told after 2 weeks that I need to give them my bank account information to pay with? What? I had already payed by credit card and my card had been charged for 2 weeks already. I told them I would be contacting the BBB to file a complaint in which I got a threatening email saying that if I write any derogatory remarks they will pursue all legal means against me. What kind of business does this to a customer at Christmas time? I just wanted the product I ordered and payed for instead I get threatened! This is a real buyer BEWARE.

43 Al S January 2, 2011 at 2:58 pm

Trace,

I’ve been buying AND SELLING and TRADING silver and gold since 2004. I started with no knowledge and hundreds of Web sites and local dealers. Here’s my bottom line. For purchases over $2,000 use California Numismatics [CNI, golddealer.com]. No shipping for orders over $2,000. They post their buy and sell figures so you know the spread. Place an order by phone and mail a check. Simple. For bigger purchases, such a a $1,000-face bag of pre 1964 silver or 20 ounces of gold, use Tulving. Place a call, mail a check. Tulving.com. No shipping charge. Tulving’s prices are among the cheapest in the world and I rarely hear him mentioned. Every major dealer is aware of Tulving and nobody talks, because they cannot beat his prices. Simple. Next APMEX, but they will charge up to $25 shipping. Order online. Mail a check. They will send you a popcorn tin at Christmas! Simple. I’ve ordered silver “rounds” from Northwest Territorial Mint, but expect to wait two months to receive your order. Shipping included and low premiums. It is wise to establish a relationship with local dealers as they are the ones you will most likely sell back to. Always establish that the seller will by back what he sells. Finally, it’s not the price that matters as much as the spread between “buy” and “sell”. Silver “rounds” are cheaper than silver Eagles. But the buy-sell spread is often $1 for both. The Eagles are prettier and more recognizable. When I sell to individuals there is always the question whether an item is really silver. With silver Eagles, there is no question of content. Always ask a seller what he will pay today to buy back the coin he sells. That’s your “spread”. Avoid eBay except for small purchases. My study of eBay prices is that coins there sell higher than from dealers. Just some tidbits. Appreciate what you are doing.

44 Trace Mayer, J.D. January 2, 2011 at 7:28 pm

Hi Al S,

Thanks for the tips and your personal strategy. I just about finished my popcorn from Apmex. Yummy! I agree about the spreads which you have to watch.

My own strategy is to just accumulate physical coins so I do not have much experience trading. When I trade the price on the metals I do larger amounts with leverage such as with futures or the ETFs. Then I plow the profits into passive cash-flow investments or more physical via GoldMoney or physical coins. For portfolio balance I try to keep physical coins in my possession equal in price to my monthly passive cash-flow. For example, if I want $3,000/month of passive income then I will have two American gold eagles and six American Silver Eagles.

45 kumanari January 3, 2011 at 1:32 am

I dare to say most people don’t have a clue as to the depth of what we are facing and where things are headed. Though there are unscrupulous dealers out there you must understand you have REAL MONEY no matter how much you paid! If you understand where this is going, silver under $100 gold under $2000 is a freakin bargain. Anyone worried about where or to whom they will”sell” their money to just doesn’t get IT. What are you going to “sell” your MONEY for…paper???Many dealers will be seen as fools as they will have traded real wealth for paper.This is the end of this paradigm and the beginning of a new paradigm. History is littered with fools who failed to recognize the sea change, like the guy on the beach in the tsunami. Most of our modern world is built on fraud and theft but it is coming to an end, it is a question of balance, humans must come correct. I am not about “selling” pms. I am storing for the WINTER so civilization may continue when humanity comes to it’s senses. Please go study history not his story…Buckminster Fuller, Martin Armstrong,Kondratieff etc. This is how civilizations FAIL the waterfall effect. Peace Out

46 JohnH. March 28, 2011 at 7:35 am

So far I have found Provident Metals to be the best all around as far as Price, User friendly website, shipping and just all out convenience of being able to buy right on their website without having to talk to anyone or salesman persuading you to purchase something other than what you want. If you know what you’re looking for and you don’t need any sales pitches go to http://www.providentmetals.com/. I also have used Apmex as well but the price of shipping was ridiculous(between $17-$25 depending on their current deals and on your quantity). CNI would be the best if you could buy right from their website but unfortunately you have to call. Goldline I have not used but have heard horror stories from their pricing to their policies and practices, Don’t see how they have a BBB A rating. Gainesville seems pretty good as far as price but have not used them yet. I also like http://goldsilver.com/ Mike Maloney is a financial and economic Guru but pricing is not the best I have seen. He really has good advice that I get through his website and also he has a lot of videos out on youtube and google that are very informative.

47 RunToSilver April 3, 2011 at 6:08 pm

Folks: Short and sweet…There is no way that anyone can put BullionDirect.com in the same breath as any dealer, or especiallly Apmex. I have purchased MANY MANY times from the “Nucleo” exchange on the BullionDirect cite. They will blow away any other dealer out there because, simply put, you are not buying from another dealer but from other individuals on the cite. Plus you can buy as much or as little as you want and store your metal in their vault– for FREE, no strings attached. Then you have the option of accumulating slowly and then having it delivered WHEN YOU WANT, or selling it back to other individuals if you decided to liquidate some of you holding for whatever reason. This setup is unique and excellent. I bought some 90% quarters less than two weeks ago 80 cents under spot. Apmex looks very expensive compared to them. I have used Gainsville (excellent, but pricey compared to BD), Northwest Territorial Mint (same thing), Westminster Mint (same thing and their shipping is not as tight as BD), Scottsdale Silver ( love their “Chunkies”) but the name of the game is number of ozs and the clear winner is BullionDirect (BD). I also use GoldMoney. Mr. Meyer said to do your due diligence and you folks simply didn’t do enough homework. I’m not rich so I did my homework. I usually don’t spend anytime writing on the economic websites that I visit, but to put Apmex in the same breath with BD is a joke. Full disclosure= I do not work for BD in any way, shape or form. Do your homework folks!!!!

48 FedUp April 10, 2011 at 12:28 pm

One of several factors not even mentioned, but extremely relevant to everyone’s PRIVACY, is the PRIVACY POLICY, or lack thereof, each of the so-called “Authorized Dealers” the US Mint OUTSOURCES to employs… Folks, take the time to READ each & every “dealers privacy policy” – IF you care & value your own self protection & rapidly disappearing right to privacy on all levels.
Just as the IRS has outsourced/abdicated ITS responsibility to “collect & process” tax filers “voluntary compliance in filing tax returns” to the 24 or so “authorized” “private, for profit” tax software entities that the IRS disclaimer makes abundantly clear the IRS does NOT ENDORSE nor VOUCH for in any way shape or form – and it forces tax filers to assume 100% responsibility & accountability for the timely & accurate filing of their returns as well as THEIR “voluntary selection of one of the IRA ‘Authorized’ but not affiliated or endorsed software providers…read the onerous dense legaleze of each of the 24+ “authorized” providers listed on the IRS website and one quickly discovers:
1) none of these “authorized” tax software providers make ANY warrantee’s of any kind – they essentially abdicate all accountability, responsibility & suitability stating use of their product is on an “as is” basis & specifically is without any warrantee – the USER assumes all risk;
2) THEY COLLECT & STORE tax filers personal, private, financial data on their UNDISCLOSED SERVERS for an UNDISCLOSED period of time…then transmit the taxpayers data to the IRS.
The reason everyone ought to be furious about this scheme, as with all other self serving, self perpetuating government scheme’s that are in direct opposition to OUR individual rights to privacy & security & liberties is because the Treasury Secretary during Clinton administration made the purposeful, deliberate decision to FORCE taxpayers to file electronically – but denied all of us the right & ability to do so directly with the IRS, under the false guise that the Treasury Secy “didn;t want the IRS getting involved in selecting tax software” so they “partnered” with the private, highly lucrative & profitable PROFESSIONAL TAX PREPARER’s business (CPA’s & Lawyers)… who have consistently been opposed to ANY tax reform for decades – for obvious, self serving purposes. Virtually NONE of the nit wits manipulating the tax code in DC from duplicitous Barney Franks to the minions crafting the mind boggling incomprehensible & contradictory voluminous tax code, instructions & forms are required to prepare their own tax returns…
IF they were barred from using CPA’s & tax pro’s and were required to actually expend the obscene, uncompensated amount of time the average person is forced to do BEFORE SUBMITTING THEIR DATA to a so-called tax preparer (who also do not take any responsibility for the data they require YOU to prepare & submit to them & charge you OBSCENE sums merely to verify & file your data) these same political elite’s abusing US & OUR money, mistreating us as indentured servants they have deliberately reduced all of us to become would REFORM & simplify the tax code immediately. Their whole agenda is to confiscate more of our money – from the private productive sector – to squander lavishly on their “Pet” constituencies & pay back their biggest enablers, the lobbyists.
DON’T succumb to the IRS /Treasury agenda – file a paper return directly with the IRS, no matter how seemingly “inconvenient” or slower it may seem – IF you wish to restrict the number of databases & prying eyes that have unfettered access to your most sensitive financial & personal data. Beware, however, doing even this is no assurance your data will not be compromised as the FBI named the IRS the number one LEAST secure government entity when it comes to protecting your personal/private info…Dept of Ed is second worst.
What does THIS have to do with PM’s? Plenty.
The lengthy list of the US Mint “authorized dealers” all have their own “privacy policies” – some more easily accessed than others. READ THEM.
If you don’t want a paper trail – for whatever reason – do NOT order online & NEVER use a credit card…even issuing a bank check or initiating a bank wire guarantees there will be a paper trail. Whether one is concerned about the “remote” possibility of another FDR confiscation or not – it really isn’t any of the government’s business how you spend your own hard earned money & savings – despite the tyrannical micromanagement & intrusion into our personal lives, attempting to manipulate, dictate & control BEHAVIOR.
AMPEX has many strong attributes from ease of website navigation to favorable reviews by customers – but read THEIR “How to order” and privacy policy & you may be deeply disappointed, and outraged.
Many “dealers” some REQUIRE securing your order with a credit card,
as gainesville coins does…this creates a paper trail that really defeats the entire purpose of “Insurance” and puts your personal as well as financial safety at risk…
One dealer not mentioned above but who has a strong following is Don Stoutt of ColoradoGold…his prices are transparent & website enables scrolling over each PM for the mark-up. It’s a three person operation. They disclose they do NOT collect or retain your information in any database…yet, in reading through the various FAQ’s etc, it was discovered that if you have ordered from them previously, futiure orders can be expedited…begging the question, “if they do NOT retain your information other than for shipping your order, HOW can they ‘recognize’ you & expedite any future oders?” The other issue is they disclose they order from A-Mark – another California outfit that happens to be one of the largest domestic suppliers, also “authorized” by US Mint…Colorado gold claims they “only” mark up
1% over THEIR price – what they pay A-Mark. Do the math & one quickly realizes the total mark-up is equivilent to 5% to 6% depending on the product. In addition, the minimum number of ounces to avoid an additional $25.00 fee, is substantial, precluding most small buyers from ordering from them – unless they are willing to fork over an unnecessary additional $25.00 which is not recoverable. Their 1% mark-up ON TOP of A-Mark’s dealer spread over spot charged to Colorado Gold does include shipping and delivery – which is a huge plus compared to what Investment Rarities & others gouge.
There are so many issues people need to thoroughly investigate and become familiar with BEFORE they venture into this highly rigged, grossly manipulated “market” – especially the whole “middleman” Dealer arena… there can’t be enough words of warning to all buyers… especially calculating the enormous FEES involved not only in acquiring & taking physical delivery – but, when the time MAY arrive that some holdings may need to be liquidated…this is especially pertinent to any Self Directed PM IRA’s – regardless of the various Custodian’s who use yet another Depository to sort your PM, either in “unallocated” or “allocated” form:
do NOT trust “unallocated” and be willing to pay far higher fees for any so called “allocated” account – and make darn sure you DON’T use any of the TBTF wealth hyjackers, especially HSBC, JP Morgan etc. Fidelitrade is a pretty straight forward, easy to use, transparent website, from which you can order online, just be aware of their order/privacy policy before you commit…they use Delaware deposit for storage just as ALL the Self Directed IRA Custodians seem to use as well.
this is a LUCRATIVE PYRAMID FEE GOUGING SCHEME ENABLED BY none other than OUR US Mint… since PM do NOT earn interest – do your homework on the annual FEES you will pay out of your PM IRA holdings if you go this route – then ADD in the exhorbinant delivery related fees & “account termination fees” and you will quickly see that for the PRIVILEGE of USING your money, the Custodians & Depository as well as Dealers make out like the bandits they are, AT YOUR EXPENSE.
As far as MONEX goes: AVOID THEM LIKE THE PLAGUE they are.
This isn’t mere sour grapes nor result of some personal “mistake.” They misrepresented then lied then committed egregious violations – order was immediately rescinded within the 10 days permitted/required by law and had the audacity to withhold thousands of dollars from the sum that was supposed to be deposited into an interest bearing account – at far greater rates than banks were paying at the time – but wasn’t, instead the shyster rep made an UNAUTHORIZED trade misusing the money that was supposed to be deposited into said interest bearing account – and which, upon receipt of th eUNauthorized “confirmation” was rescinded immediately. The Compliance “officer” agreed the rep had made an egregious breach and “rescinded” that reps unauthorized action – returned the money, LESS THOUSANDS of dollars MONEX falsely claimed was the difference between their rep’s unauthorized trade execution & the proper objection & rescission of the unauthorized trade within the 10 days the law requires…
MONEX WRONGLY WITHHELD THOUSANDS of dollars of MY MONEY IT WAS REQUIRED TO REFUND TO ME for the ILLICIT, UNLAWFUL, UNAUTHORIZED MISUSE of my money by THEIR REP who stated and confirmed would be deposited into the interest bearing account UNTIL I WAS READY & COMFORTABLE to make a future acquisition.
THER has been NO REMEDY for the money MONEX STOLE – except the “rep” was terminated & the wrondoing causing the loss is a long term tax loss – which is of LITTLE benefit as there should NOT have been any loss whatsoever – least of all for me.
STAY AWAY FROM MONEX no matter who or how many people may say otherwise – IF you value your money & rights. they need to be put out of business.
the CORRUPT FEDERAL officials & all the self serving bureaucrat’s perpetuating the scam by the Federal Reserve, CFTC, Treasury or US Mint will NOT “protect” you any more than the BANKRUPT FDIC … it’s all an illusion.
If you are fortunate enough to have a local coin dealer – reputable that is – you are far better off than the majority without such access…buy directly, IN CASH NOT REPORTABLE and keep your physical PM secure yourself…no banks, no reporting of credit card transactions or to the IRS of bank “cash transactions”
Jim Sinclair of jsmineset.com has a free website with an abundance of credible information for anyone willing to invest requisite time researching this highly manipulated industry…he was in charge of “undoing” the Hunt Brothers ALLEGED attempt at cornering the silver market and had his own brokerage firm decades ago.
While he does NOT give investment advice nor recommend dealers or traders…
his trusted “allies” include Alf Field, Martin Armstrong, fmr Princeton Economics – wrongly detained for over seven years without being charged, denied representations, held for “contempt of court” and subjected to brutal physical attack in solitary confinement, as Guards watched, to COERCE a contrived ‘confession” of a crime he did NOT commit – Republic Bank did & scapegoated Armstrong, so the US Govt & its cartel via Goldman Sachs could steal his proprietary economic models & methods, Monty Guild of Guild Investments, J.B. Slear of FtWealth (more futures/traders oriented) and Greg Hunter of USAWatchdog along with retired Dean of Investing & original/longest running newsletter of all time among many others.
This isn’t a plug for Mr. Sinclair nor his website…no affiliation whatsoever other than an appreciation for his wise insights for Free without any solicitations or behavior tracking devises on his webpages – unlike the vast majority.
On that topic, Wall Street Journal belatedly ran an excellent series on the spying & behavioral webtracking with embedded web beacons planted on every webpage surfed…along with some free, downloadable webtools to assist in not only exposing the growing litany of devices advertisers are employing against you but to actually BLOCK them from tracking your every move…such as Ghostery.com
& ABP, among other tools you should check out.
As far as GoldMoney or Bullion Vault or Peter Schiff’s favored Perth Mint Certificate’s…after laborious, abundant research of ALL PM dealers, accounts and options, the best advice remains: take physical delivery if you want to avoid even the remotest possibility of having difficulty accessing or obtaining YOUR “assets”
If any number of events transpire, from ‘banking holidays’ or political unrest or Solar Flare’s disrupting entire electrical grid & communications – do you really want to risk being able to connect online with some remote computer – and hope you can access your digital account much less actually receive “your” ALLOCATED PM? Do you Trust ANY bank or other regulated business entity with YOUR money? You are nothing but low hanging fruit ripe for the picking, of banks, government & it’s political elite’s seeking ways to confiscate more of YOUR money for THEIR purposes…any business entity will similarly protect themselves long ahead of your interests, esp. when & if the government is involved.
Do you own due diligence – KNOW WHAT QUESTIONS TO ASK & then be sure to get satisfactory answers. It isn’t what you know, rather what you don’t know that will hurt you. Know before you leap…trust no one – cuz in this topsy turvy, backwards world, you truly are on your own and can only rely on your own knowledge and instincts. Too many are merely out for themselves…thanks to the “ME GENERATION” synchophants.

49 MT April 22, 2011 at 11:03 am

Disappointing experience!! Please do not order from them if you take the risk of something happening during the shipping process. I have placed 2 orders both around 10K, the first order arrived safely, the 2nd order, someone had opened the box to steal a roll (worth around $800) and no help from Gainesville AT ALL.

Not only did it take me persistently calling them for a week to speak to someone, but I’m pretty much told I’m out of luck since I signed for the package. Keep in mind that the hole was not very visible to become with, packaging was poor and UPS will NOT let you go through the content before you sign for it so there was NO WAY we could’ve known something was missing.

BUY AT YOUR OWN RISK. DON’T LET THEIR INSURANCE ASSURE YOU OF ANYTHING. OH, YAH AND THEY SHIP VIA UPS, CURRENCY IS NOT COVERED UNDER UPS…

I’ll keep out of date if I hear anything else. Short of legal action, I don’t think the company will do anything to offer help at all. This is very disheartening. Please don’t’ order from this company but if you do, just hope that you get good packaging and the slightest imperfection, return the package because fi someone decides to “checkout” the content of the package, you’re out of luck.

50 Brett May 9, 2011 at 11:35 am

DO NOT buy from GAINESVILLE Coins if you want to come out of it in profit. They have many deceptive measures in place to try and get as much money from you as possible. For example, If you make 2 orders and decide that you want to cancel one, they will charge you 5% deposit on the price even though in their terms and conditions it says that only “1f” you put a credit card on file does this charge apply. For international orders, they dont ask you to this so logically no 5% is enforceable. Yet they will hold your money and demand this be done before their either release whats left of your money or whats left of your order minus the 5%. Furhtermore, if they dont get the money in 24 hours, they “cancel” your order causing you to pay the 5% before they give it back. How, I ask, do they expect the money to transfer at such as speed, especially when some of the wires are international? Use Apmex instead, they are a larger compnay bound by stricter terms and conditions. Dont purchase from GAINESVILLE or will surely regret it.

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